Brian, Craig et al, With regards to the positional data format, from what I remember this just seems to be a slight editorial mistake, and we had agreed for both of the fields to be in the format required. For the time stamp, this point was raised for you Brian and from what I can remember the discussion came out with the following results: 1. After discussions with the IMO Technical Representative at the meting (Vijayan, please correct me if I get any of this wrong), it was felt that if the equipment did not transmit the seconds element of the time stamp this would then be defaulted to "00" (zero zero) in the XML format and this would be acceptable. 2. It was decided to keep this in order to be able to be able to allow an element of future proofing into the system, as we have no knowledge of what information future equipment will transmit it was felt that it would be easier, at this stage, to incorporate a seconds element into the time stamp rather than try to alter an already live system at a future date. 3. It was also felt that it would be best to keep the seconds element in the positional message time stamps to allow continuity across the entire LRIT system, as within the other time stamp elements in the system a higher level of accuracy is required. Again, if an XML expert can provide more information, it was felt the if this information was not transmitted then it could be defaulted to "00". if anybody wishes further discussion or clarification on this please don't hesitate to contact me. Regards, Guy Guy Sear E-Navigation Projects Manager Maritime and Coastguard Agency United Kingdom Tel : + 44 (0) 2380 329 431 Mobile : +44 (0) 7710 877 840 Fax : +44 (0) 2380 329 290 Email: Guy.Sear(a)mcga.gov.uk Hi, Hayley Many thanks for your email. I can agree that the text of the document is clear; but that the wording in the table is not consistent and appears even to contradict the text you quote. My copy of the document shows wording for 1.1.1.1 that is different: "The intent of this document is to outline the technical specifications for communication within the international Long-Range Identification and Tracking (LRIT) system as stated in the terms of reference of resolution MSC.211(81)." Your reference is new text in 2.2.2.4 in the copy that I received (15-02-2007 LRIT ad hoc WG) In Table 2, the heading indicates "Parameter provided by LRIT Shipborne Equipment" and then describes the various elements, including specifying the format. It is clear to me and others that this method of presenting the information in the table means that the information transmitted by the shipborne equipment *must* follow the format written in the table. This is where the difficulty lies - the wording is over-prescriptive and does not accord with the wording in 2.2.2.4. My original email showed how, in Inmarsat C position reporting at least, the way the information is transmitted. Other shipborne systems probably will have their own format for presenting data to the ASP. May I suggest, please, that we stick to requiring that the specific data elements (unique identifier, latitude/longitude and date/time of the position) are transmitted from the ship and then only start to prescribe the format for onward transmission from the ASP? In other words, as long as the shipborne equipment transmits, as a minimum, the required elements, any format is acceptable. This allows for all approved shipborne LRIT systems to be offered, no matter in which order or format the data is presented. This approach will also allow the table to be in accord with the new wording in 2.2.2.4 I hope that this is clear. Your hard work is very much appreciated and it is clearly understood that the document remains a "work in progress". Please don't take my input as criticism - it is not! All I seek is clarity of the wording for all. With best wishes Brian Brian Mullan Head, Maritime Safety Services Inmarsat, 99 City Road, London EC1Y 1AX, UK Tel: +44 (0)20 7728 1464 Fax: +44 (0)20 7728 1689 Mob: +44 (0)7711 495836 www.inmarsat.com ________________________________ From: Hayley, Craig [mailto:HayleyCR@DFO-MPO.GC.CA] Sent: 31 May 2007 19:05 To: ccglrit-gcclrit(a)lists.ncf.ca Cc: Brian Mullan Subject: RE: [Ccglrit-gcclrit] June 12-14 meeting of the Ad hoc Working Group onEngineering Aspects of LRIT, Hamburg Germany Hi Brian, Thanks for the e-mail. I hope more people will take the time to read the documents and provide comments. I assume you are referring to the LRIT communication document. Please note the following text in the LRIT communications document: 1.1.1.1 The parameters added by the LRIT shipborne equipment include the latitude, longitude, Time Stamp when the position was generated, and the shipborne equipment identifier. The "Format" of these parameters as outlined in table 2 indicates how the parameters shall be formatted while the information is contained within the LRIT message and does not specify the format of how the shipborne equipment transmits the information. Regarding your concerns with the format of the date/time... The only difference that I can detect between the date/time you state and what is in Table 2 of the LRIT communications document is the separators ("-" versus ":") for the year, month, day, hour and minute. The separator used to separate the year, month, etc in the date stated in table 2 is not important and in no way linked to the format coming out of the shipborne equipment. The format is with respect to SOAP messages communicated along the various LRIT communication segments. CSPs for the IDC shall have to "build" SOAP messages complying with table 2 in the communications document using the format from the ship borne equipment. The important thing with the time stamp is that seconds are not transmitted. Regarding your concerns with the format for latitude... We had a discussion on your e-mail and the intention was to implement your recommendation. I can't recall why the "seconds" component of the latitude didn't change to decimal minutes with a precision of 2 decimal places. The most likely reason is that I forgot to incorporate this change in the document due to the numerous requests. My apologies on this topic. I will make the change for latitude to decimal minutes unless someone raises a compelling reason not to change. Any body from the Communications group recall if there was a specific reason why we didn't make the change (Jilian, Guy, etc.)??? I would like to high light to everyone that these documents are in constant flux as a result of many requests from different inputs at the Ad Hoc meeting. Thus, it is important to fully read the documents that come out of each meeting to ensure that any particular topic of interest is addressed in a satisfactory manner. Thanks, Craig Hayley System Engineer Canadian Coast Guard 709-772-7740 ________________________________ From: ccglrit-gcclrit-bounces(a)lists.ncf.ca [mailto:ccglrit-gcclrit-bounces@lists.ncf.ca] On Behalf Of Brian Mullan Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2007 12:35 PM To: ccglrit-gcclrit(a)lists.ncf.ca Subject: Re: [Ccglrit-gcclrit] June 12-14 meeting of the Ad hoc Working Group onEngineering Aspects of LRIT, Hamburg Germany Thanks, Tracy In table 2 I note that the format of date/time is still shown as YYYY-MM-DD-HH-MM. My earlier email (attached) made comment on this. Also in Table 2, note appears to have been taken of my comments regarding latitude/longitude position for Longitude only, but ignores Latitude. We must not start requiring reformatting for transmitted data that is already designed into existing shipboard equipment - PLEASE! Many thanks Brian Brian Mullan Head, Maritime Safety Services Inmarsat, 99 City Road, London EC1Y 1AX, UK Tel: +44 (0)20 7728 1464 Fax: +44 (0)20 7728 1689 Mob: +44 (0)7711 495836 www.inmarsat.com ________________________________ From: ccglrit-gcclrit-bounces(a)lists.ncf.ca [mailto:ccglrit-gcclrit-bounces@lists.ncf.ca] On Behalf Of Peverett, Tracy Sent: 29 May 2007 22:27 To: ccglrit-gcclrit(a)lists.ncf.ca Subject: [Ccglrit-gcclrit] June 12-14 meeting of the Ad hoc Working Group onEngineering Aspects of LRIT, Hamburg Germany Second of two e-mails As promised, attached please find the updated LRIT Communications specification. Best regards Tracy Tracy Peverett Senior Policy Analyst Canadian Coast Guard Tel: 1-613-990-4046 Fax: 1-613-998-3255 e-mail: peverettT(a)dfo-mpo.gc.ca This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. 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