John,
This sounds like a great plan. What would be the best way
for us to “report” our incidents to you? Via email or using our
shared website?
I’ll start asking our members to consider recording the
incident so that we can get some action from the police. Mutual respect
will go a long way.
Dan, if we are patient and work together this community will
change… just think just 2 years ago this community riding group did not
exist especially with this many dedicated members and we are growing all the
time! The more we continue the dialogue with the police and the community
the easier it will be become to ride without fear on our roadways.
I believe there are Sunday and Morning morning rides this
weekend. Everyone be safe and enjoy the long weekend.
Jennifer Laevens
519-436-4600 Ext 2926
From:
ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca [mailto:ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca] On Behalf
Of John Sigurjonsson
Sent: July 29, 2010 2:32 PM
To: 'Chatham-Kent Commmunity Cycling Group'
Subject: Re: [CKcycle] pull up display
Jen, thanks for your response.
When we meet with the police brass we could present a
description of the kinds of incidents you are experiencing with specific
examples and discuss with them the best response. Can they act on the basis of
a phoned-in report? What specific info would they need?
Police Services regularly issues media releases on
safety-elated subjects and those could emphasize what’s happening on CK
roads and advise drivers on their responsibilities and the potential penalties
for violation. Also, the ACSC is working on a regular media feature along the
lines of “Sergeant Domony Advises” dealing in part with cycling
issues and your experiences could be incorporated into that.
The Chief and his people also recognize that they need to
train the entire force on the rights and responsibilities of cyclists (and
motorists relating to cyclists) to avoid the kind of occurrence that Dan
describes (“going too fast, er, no, taking too much of the lane”)
CKCCG can help them focus their training by letting them know about that kind
of incident.
If Cycling Community members will post the
experiences/incidents and suggestions that they would like taken to a
discussion with Police Services I will volunteer to compile them (I’m
retired, so have some time available), review the compilation with Dan and Jen
L for fine tuning, and then report it back to the entire listserve for comment.
In the meantime I’ll let Police Services know what we’re doing and get
their commitment to review our product and meet with us for discussion of it.
Cycling Community can decide who should represent them at that meeting.
Does that sound like a plan?
Regards
John
Sigurjonsson
Member Services
Cycle
Chatham-Kent
519-352-0883
-----Original
Message-----
From: ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca [mailto:ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca]
On Behalf Of Laevens, Jennifer
Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 11:47 AM
To: Chatham-Kent Commmunity Cycling Group
Subject: Re: [CKcycle] pull up display
John,
I think that’s a great
idea. Could you give us some idea of what the police would like to see in
terms of an “incident report”? Do they want us to call 911
from the side of the road to report the make and model of the vehicle or just
an “after the fact” report? Dan and I have been harassed on
the river road as well and I would have liked to call it in but didn’t
think 911 was the right venue.
The 4 E’s sound good to
me. I believe the schools are doing a pretty good with education for kids
as is the Children’s Safety Village and the bike rodeo held at the same
time as the Rotary Ride. We are trying but I think the frustration comes
from our more long distance riders feeling our safety compromised on each and
every outing. We would like to know how the police will handle these
complaints.
At one time there used to be
a police officer or two on bicycles. This seems to be the best approach
for “pulling over” other cyclists on the sidewalks. Perhaps,
some enforcement for those infractions and some media attention will keep the
education moving in the right direction.
Jennifer Laevens
519-436-4600 Ext 2926
From: ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca
[mailto:ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca] On Behalf Of John Sigurjonsson
Sent: July 29, 2010 10:44 AM
To: 'Chatham-Kent Commmunity Cycling Group'
Subject: Re: [CKcycle] pull up display
Thanks for your
response Dan
Sorry to hear that your experience with local Police Services has been negative.
We have had a very good working relationship with Chief Dennis Poole and his
staff – particularly the Sergeant in charge of traffic matters, Mike
Domony. Mike is actively involved with Public Health and the ACSC in developing
an education program to support the shift to cycling as transportation.
We’ve had several meetings with these Police Services personnel on both
enforcement and educational issues. If CKCycling Community were to put together
a list of incidents and suggested improvements we could together take it to
Police Services. I’m sure we’d get a good hearing.
What do you
think of that idea?
We don’t need to debate whether education or racks are more important.
Both can be done at the same time along with bike lanes and enforcement issues.
Work is underway on all of these elements right now in Chatham-Kent.
Communities throughout North America and Europe are working at all of these
elements simultaneously in efforts to shift travel from cars to bikes.
I certainly agree with you that most people won’t cycle if they
don’t feel safe doing it. Many decades of experience by
professionals working on this have led to the belief that we need what is
called “the four Es”: Engineering (infrastructure), Education,
Encouragement, and Enforcement.
Regards
John Sigurjonsson
Member Services
Cycle
Chatham-Kent
519-352-0883
-----Original
Message-----
From: ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca [mailto:ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca]
On Behalf Of Daniel Brousseau
Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 3:32 PM
To: Chatham-Kent Commmunity Cycling Group
Subject: Re: [CKcycle] pull up display
John,
Sorry to say but I don't agree with all your statements...
As stated in the meeting where Matt, James and I where... a Bike Rack is the
least of the riders concerns. It's all about education as with no education
they won't come out.
The police department here in Chatham is just a joke in their dealing with the
rules of the road with cyclists and cars...
The LAWS are there already in place to enforce SAFE Cycling but they just opt
to ignore them and only enforce them at their discretion.
Also note that our Sunday/Wednesday rides do not consist of just starting and
leaving from one location... we do stop at various locations and sometimes
leave our bikes leaning against a wall. This does not stop us cause there is no
bike racks.
So again, Bike Racks & Bike Lanes/Paths will not get more people out if
they feel unsafe to even be on the road/sidewalk(Kids Only) so they can get to
them. Don't forget there are MANY EMPTY Bike Racks here in the Chatham area. So
putting more in won't help on getting more cyclists out.
Also this discussion is about the poster in it self and where they should be
placed. This is where the Cyclist of this group come into play as you would be
surprised how many also cycle as a mode of transportation but also drive a
vehicle. So we know both side of the coin on this topic.
I know John you have this great envision of what Chatham-Kent should turn into
but it won't happen over night. That is why Education is your most important
factor in this planing... Mostly when your local police force is just a farce
on enforcement of the Moving Violations.
When I got pulled over on Grand Ave early summer for "Going to fast"
then changed to "Taking to much room on the road". I was hopping he
would try and fine me... this way it would of been a foot in the door to show
them local officers that the law is the law and can't just apply it at their
discretion.
Yes it can take as much time to fine a cyclist just as a automotive driver...
but still the rules are the same for both.
Same Roads, Same Rules, Same Rights
John Sigurjonsson wrote:
Some super ideas in this discussion of
driver/rider education and its great to see CK Cycle Community take an interest
in cycling advocacy. There is unspent budget from a grant for the educational
program in 2010 so a lot of ideas are affordable this year but may not be next
year.
When considering what should be done
to promote cycling in Chatham-Kent be aware that the primary community benefit
from Active Transportation comes from replacing motorized trips with
people-powered trips. So the ACSC needs to create conditions that attract
cyclists ranging from the ten year old commuting to school (instead of being
Chauffeured by mom) to granny with her shopping tricycle. These cyclists are
very different from the average member of ckcycle. For example:
Their cycle routes are urban, not the rural roaming ckcycle does on Tuesday and
Wednesday evenings and Sunday mornings..
The purpose of their trip is utilitarian – get from A to B to work, shop,
play, etc.. They enjoy the ride but the primary purpose of the ride isn’t
recreational. So they want direct routes to their destination without having to
make detours to find low-traffic routes.
They are not comfortable in traffic. They need bike lanes or paths separated
from motor vehicles. We’re trying to get those built.
They need end-of-trip facilities (e.g. secure bike racks). It might be nice if
your Sunday breakfast stop had decent secure racks, but otherwise it’s
probably not an issue for your recreational rides that basically begin and end
at home. For utilitarian riders who are going to park the bike where they work,
shop, play tennis, attend classes etc secure parking is an issue.
If these folks in Chatham made the
same percentage of their trips by bike as is done in some European cities, we
would have about 10,000 bikes on Chatham streets at rush hours. Wouldn’t
that be something to see!
Regards
John Sigurjonsson
Member Services
Cycle
Chatham-Kent
519-352-0883
-----Original
Message-----
From: ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca
[mailto:ckcycle-bounces@lists.ncf.ca]
On Behalf Of Josette deBrouwer
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2010 11:27 PM
To: Chatham-Kent Commmunity Cycling Group
Subject: Re: [CKcycle] pull up display
They should be visible at all municipal
info centres and other municipal properties, especially arenas. Also, how about
the drivers licence bureau (whatever that is called) and car dealerships? Like
Geoff, I had three incidents on one ride along hwy 3 west of Blenheim on
Sunday. Not fun.
On 10-07-26 4:12 PM, "James Lively" <jalively@cogeco.ca>
wrote:
As we were riding along on
Sunday, I was asked about the bike signs on the roads. Here’s the first
information going out to the public. Let me know what you think as this is a
first go, and I’ll take your comments back to the Active Communities
Committee.
Thanks
James.
Hello everyone. This pull up display (x2) will be placed in the Wallaceburg
and Chatham Libraries for the month of August. (a bit too large for the
other Libraries), then they can be relocated elsewhere as needed. There
will also be a similar, accompanying poster on the wall – with the
informational tear off sheets. Please advise if anything needs to be
changed. We wanted to keep it light(meaning not too many words) –
focused on the Share the Road and the two different road signs. It is
intended for an adult audience.
_______________________________________________
CKcycle mailing list
CKcycle@lists.ncf.ca
http://lists.ncf.ca/mailman/listinfo/ckcycle
_______________________________________________CKcycle mailing listCKcycle@lists.ncf.cahttp://lists.ncf.ca/mailman/listinfo/ckcycle